Hey All,
I decided to test out the Cone Air filter install today, and more importantly, compare some data points to try and separate myth from fact. The first thing I wanted to validate was whether or not IAT (Intake Air Temperatures) change much, since a cone style filter does not draw air from outside, but from inside the engine compartment. Secondly, I wanted to compare the flow rates at the MAF and see if it made any changes to MAP. For my data logging, I used an Actron CP9185 Auto Scanner. This is a nice tool, and allows for all sorts of fun when you don't have access to tuning software.

First up was to take a look at the stock setup, and see what it does. I did runs in both 3rd and 4th gear, but the results were pretty much the same. From here on out, all my testing is done in 3rd gear.

What I found was the following with the stock box. Air flow at a 100% ECU load flows around 34lb/m (average) for full out runs, with MAP peaking at 73.8in /Hg (full boost) and settling to around 66in/Hg towards redline. The IAT stayed equal to the exterior temps, which is a good thing. Means we weren't sucking in any air that was warmer then the outside air.

Next up was the standard cone filter you can buy at any auto parts store. I went with a K&N air cone filter to ensure it had high flow rates. This is what I found with the cone filter.

First things first, the IAT was not noticeably effected by the filter. I left the snorkel on, so this may be providing enough cool air to ensure that the engine is still able to draw in cooler then engine bay air. This is a good thing. Air flow at 100% ECU load also went up by an average of 2lb/m across the board. However, this did not equate to more manifold pressure. For whatever reason, MAP was down 2in/Hg across the board. I find this interesting because this was reporting exactly what I was seeing in the car. I was having a harder time building boost. My boost gauge showed some eradicate behavior that I did not get with the stock box. To verify that the cone filter was causing this, I put the stock components back on, and the issue went away. Not sure why this is happening, since I am using a MBC, its not an ECU thing. Something to play with more in the future.

On a good note, I noticed that timing was advancing a lot faster with the Cone then with the stock air box. This may have something to do with the load cells being different, since with the stock box I was getting an ABS load of around 222 peak, but with the cone I was only getting into the 215 range. The car also felt slower to me, and a lot less linear. This may change over time, so I am going to put the cone filter back in and see if it changes over the next few days. But, right now, I am losing power with this thing, not gaining. This may be fixable though with some boost adjustments.

Are you using a reverse conical filter?

I don't know if this works, makes sense to me, but will resetting the ECU after the changes help it adjust to the new found air?

I don't know if this works, makes sense to me, but will resetting the ECU after the changes help it adjust to the new found air?
:+1:

ekkk so many technical details. for me if it increases the hp/tq it means better than the airbox. and it did in some dyno test. there are some diy heat shield too no need to worry about heat.

I'm not using a reverse conical filter just the standard K&N. I think I can feel it build boost a little slower but its much stronger in the top end. It pulls harder till red line unlike before where it was awful past 6k. Also how would I go about resetting the ECU? And if I did would the dealership be able to see that I reset the ECU and cause warranty problems?

Resetting the ECU would just get rid of your LT and ST fuel trims. It may get rid of stored performance data too, but I am not sure. Its possible that I picked up horsepower, but lost torque. Hard to tell. All I know is that I am hitting lower load cells in the ECU, because I am getting lower MAP. I will play with this more next weekend.

Just disconnect your battery for a few minutes and it should reset your computer. That is what I did. I have had the cone filter on my car fora about 900 miles and it feels better than the stock air box. But I have not proof just my butt dyno.

^ does it seem to take your turbo a little longer to spool up? Also would resetting the computer for just a new air filter do anything. Won't the computer react to the new airflow and adjust itself?

How does this mod compare to one of those drop in air filters which is suppose to increase air flow in the standard air box? I know it's cheaper, but I'm wondering about performance similarities/differences.

Dan

@PDX - It's not abnormal for a freer-flowing air filter to cause you to boost less. I have seen your results on other cars before.

How does this mod compare to one of those drop in air filters which is suppose to increase air flow in the standard air box? I know it's cheaper, but I'm wondering about performance similarities/differences.

Dan

Not sure Dan. I couldn't find a drop in filter that fit, so I was not able to test this.

Apparently there are a few AEM air filters that are supposed to fit the X

This is the one I was referring to...

http://www.worksevo.com/store/product_info.php?cPath=21&products_id=501

Dan

Ouch, $130 for a filter?!?! No thanks. A drop in filter generally doesnt do anything negative for your MAF. All the MAF issues are caused by turbulent flow that is caused by air coming in from a multi-directional setup. The stock air box is usually designed to have all the air flow in a single path that is the least turbulent to the MAF. Changing to a drop in, keeps this flow design, and allows you to increase your flow rate without getting jumpy MAF signals, which are difficult to tune and are very inconsistent.

I'd like to get a drop in for now but not 130 bucks! First time I heard that it pissed me off. K&N where are you dammit. No way can I morally spend 130 on a drop in. I hate it when some of the vendors gouge owners

yea, that drop in filter is definitely overpriced. however, i believe i read on EvoM that drop in filters worked better for the Evo IX's than the cone filters. i'm thinking that maybe it would be the same for the X's

That drop in is cleanable and reusable, not sure if that adds any value to it or not.

Dan

having taken apart my airbox recently, i dont see manufactures are gonna be able to make the product much cheaper.

its not just a filter like it was before that is inside of an enclosure, its part of the actual box itself so the sides need to be a bit more reinforced.

its more like a sandwhich.

i dont see the k&n one being the $49 or whatever it was before, it put it at more like $89.

just my view.

I have a k&n cone filter. I installed it last friday and I could notice the turbo spooling up later. I decided to give resetting the ECU a shot by disconnecting the battery. It made a big difference. The turbo spools up a good 500-700 rpm earlier. Before it really didn't start pulling till almost 4 now its back to around 3 again and it still pulls a lot harder to redline. If you install a cone filter make sure you reset your ECU.

if K&N wants to charge me more than the usual 50 bucks...like70 or 80 fine. No way will anyone get 130 for a drop in from me. I bet in few weeks if not a couple of months Perrin and others will undercut the hell outta' the Works. For now if you buy one of the Works you get 'worked:p.

I'm sure a good drop in will support the 320/320 I'm aiming for. As far as hearing the turbo spool and blow off' I'll pass. The motor is freakin loud as is and it drives me batty at cruising speeds. No doubt I'll be adding some serious sound mat to kill some of that crazy wail I get on the freeway over 4k rpm. I can only stand cruising at 70 for so long...I prefer 80+ (speed limit is 75 in Nevada)

Dang you and your crazy cool speed limits. -1 for 60 MPH speed limits.

Dang you and your crazy cool speed limits. -1 for 60 MPH speed limits.

It's great to legally speed..NHP will let you go 82 or so no problem. I know this 'cause the one that stopped me for 88 said he would have let me go if I was going 82 maybe 83:rock:. I said cool....then he wrote me up:mad:

Where in Nevada do you live? I'm in Carson City

Dan

Yeah, I'm not a big fan of cone filters, and I must say that as much as I didn't want to pay it, I bought the works filter and it's awesome. The butt dyno tells me that it's definitely made some decent power, and the turbo spools quicker than before, not later like you guys are experiencing with the cones. I would highly recommend it, but it is overpriced for sure.

There will be other, cheaper, solutions available soon I am sure. Fortunately, I am ok with waiting ;)

Hi,

I cannot disclose the company we had loaned an EVO X to test their products, but they did dyno certain products independently. First day they tested an axle back, upper intercooler pipe & drop in panel filter. Here are the results independently.

Base: 235whp & 261 ft. lbs.

Axle back: 5whp
Upper intercooler pipe: 2whp
Drop in filter: 9whp

Combined: Approx. 16whp (251whp & 276 ft. lbs)

The ambient temp. was around 70 deg.

Day two they replaced the filter box with a Short Ram Intake and added a blow off. They only dyno'd a combined run with the axle back & Upper intercooler pipe.

Approx. 20whp But torque had decreased 6 ft lbs. (255whp & 270 ft. lbs.)

The ambient temp. was around 85 deg.

They did two more runs but now adding a 10% mix of Sports Racing Fuel and got an average of 9 more whp. I was told the 10% mix increases the octane rating to 96.

First pass with race fuel: 10.5whp
Second pass with race fuel: 7.5whp
Avg: 9whp (264whp & 271 ft. lbs.)

There was only a few ft. lbs. of torque gained with the combined system.

Since the ambient temp was not consistent between the two days, it's hard to say that the short ram had the negative effect or if was the heat or the combination of the two.

On the drive back with the short ram set up, the car did not feel as responsive above 5K. It was around 85 degrees that day so I thought maybe it's the heat. However, I have driven it the following day when the temp. was around 65 deg. and I still didn't get the same high end feeling as when I was running the drop-in filter. The drop in set-up appeared to pull harder after 4.5K and seemed to get an extra surge of power at 6K. It pretty much got rid of the annoying boost taper. I'll continue to monitor this set-up to see if any CELs appear. Once the products are okayed by the manufacturer, I'll ask if I can disclose their name.

Hope this gives some insight.

Yeah, I'm not a big fan of cone filters, and I must say that as much as I didn't want to pay it, I bought the works filter and it's awesome. The butt dyno tells me that it's definitely made some decent power, and the turbo spools quicker than before, not later like you guys are experiencing with the cones. I would highly recommend it, but it is overpriced for sure.


I was getting the torque loss with the cone before I reset the ECU but after I reset the ECU it cured the loss of low end torque and the turbo spools up as early as before and pulled much harder than stock to redline.

ah cool, what sorta power you pushing out Tvall13?

Yeah, I'm not a big fan of cone filters, and I must say that as much as I didn't want to pay it, I bought the works filter and it's awesome. The butt dyno tells me that it's definitely made some decent power, and the turbo spools quicker than before, not later like you guys are experiencing with the cones. I would highly recommend it, but it is overpriced for sure.
:+1:
I also got the works drop-in filter and so far I think it is doing Great! I'm not rich (by far) but IMO you pay for quality and performance which is why most, but Not all, of my mods will be jdm tuning parts.


Hi,

I cannot disclose the company we had loaned an EVO X to test their products, but they did dyno certain products independently. First day they tested an axle back, upper intercooler pipe & drop in panel filter. Here are the results independently.

Axle back: 5whp
Upper intercooler pipe: 2whp
Drop in filter: 12whp

Combined: Approx. 20whp

The ambient temp. was around 70 deg.

Day two they replaced the filter box with a Short Ram Intake and added a blow off. They only dyno'd a combined run with the axle back & Upper intercooler pipe.

Approx. 16-17whp

The ambient temp. was around 85 deg.

They did two more runs but now adding a 10% mix of Sports Racing Fuel and got an average of 9 more whp. I was told the 10% mix increases the octane rating to 96.

First pass with race fuel: 10.5whp
Second pass with race fuel: 7.5whp

There was only a few ft. lbs. of torque gained with the combined system.

Since the ambient temp was not consistent between the two days, it's hard to say that the short ram had the negative effect or if was the heat or the combination of the two.

On the drive back with the short ram set up, the car did not feel as responsive above 5K. It was around 85 degrees that day so I thought maybe it's the heat. However, I have driven it the following day when the temp. was around 65 deg. and I still didn't get the same high end feeling as when I was running the drop-in filter. The drop in set-up appeared to pull harder after 4.5K and seemed to get an extra surge of power at 6K. It pretty much got rid of the annoying boost taper. I'll continue to monitor this set-up to see if any CELs appear. Once the products are okayed by the manufacturer, I'll ask if I can disclose their name.

Hope this gives some insight.
Thanks for sharing...... good to know and good information. :thumbup:

if K&N wants to charge me more than the usual 50 bucks...like70 or 80 fine. No way will anyone get 130 for a drop in from me. I bet in few weeks if not a couple of months Perrin and others will undercut the hell outta' the Works. For now if you buy one of the Works you get 'worked:p.

I'm sure a good drop in will support the 320/320 I'm aiming for. As far as hearing the turbo spool and blow off' I'll pass. The motor is freakin loud as is and it drives me batty at cruising speeds. No doubt I'll be adding some serious sound mat to kill some of that crazy wail I get on the freeway over 4k rpm. I can only stand cruising at 70 for so long...I prefer 80+ (speed limit is 75 in Nevada)
That good old saying of you get what you pay for is true. The works filter is not a pice of crap the side walls of the filter are made of metal and powder coated. Is $130 cheap? No but its not made cheap.

$130 for an air filter isn't cheap, but it's not outrageous for a 10-12whp gain. Unless there is something else available when the MRs finally show up I'll probably order one.

Dan

:+1:
I also got the works drop-in filter and so far I think it is doing Great! I'm not rich (by far) but IMO you pay for quality and performance which is why most, but Not all, of my mods will be jdm tuning parts.



Thanks for sharing...... good to know and good information. :thumbup:


Torque gains are much better with the drop in, according to the stats, but they did not reset the ECU as some have advise with the Short ram (cone filter) set-up. We will bring the car back next week to try to dyno at a cooler temp & reset the ECU to see if there are any changes.

Also, I have updated (edited) some info.

Regards,

I also got the works drop-in filter and so far I think it is doing Great! I'm not rich (by far) but IMO you pay for quality and performance which is why most, but Not all, of my mods will be jdm tuning parts.
I'm not rich too, my X is rich (9.9 AFR) :jk:

$130 for an air filter isn't cheap, but it's not outrageous for a 10-12whp gain. Unless there is something else available when the MRs finally show up I'll probably order one.

Dan


I suppose if you look at it that way about 11$ or so per whp. That's not bad at all. In fact that's outstanding. Still it's an A I R F I L T E R.. granted it's not the usual drop in but still someone is for sure gouging the tuner community with this one. I can't seem to get past that part. I still have deep gouging scars from many years of wild unchecked modding in the Subie world. I'm not rich nor poor and I'm not cheep. Every mod has to be top quality. If it was 75 it would be on the car already

I understand everyone's view point though...I'm desperate for extra ponies and torque too. I have a long list of stuff that comes first...like rent, cc bills, girlfreind weekend maintainance fees

$130 for an air filter isn't cheap, but it's not outrageous for a 10-12whp gain. Unless there is something else available when the MRs finally show up I'll probably order one.

Dan

They are listing it as a 27hp gain.

Im highly sceptical about a filter generating 27hp--although i guess that would be 10-12 whp. If its true that it gives 12whp then it would be worth it.

Based on several dyno, it will add 12-27HP depending your AFR. The X has a very rich AFR, some 9.5 some 10. The richer your AFR the more gain you'll get. Along with the power increase, you also get more mileage. Anyway, the X is still too rich even after changing the air filter.