Here is the brake thread, sorry it took so long!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/Brembs-1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/JDMOTO_Brakes.jpg

OEM setup - Out of the box the Evo X brakes are pretty capable. Back when I first got the car, I ran the OEM pads and rotors w/Motul RBF600 for 13 track events and time attacks. That said...I was only running the car for 20 minute sessions or less (5 lap T/A sessions) while making sure to focus on proper braking. I hear alot of complaining about the stock setup, but really they aren't that bad if you work on braking style. I'm the kind of driver that brakes a little early and carries more speed through the corner instead of the usual stomp on the pedal huge at the last minute, then get back on the throttle. That style...may not not work best for the stock setup haha.

Once the OEM pads (and any pad really) get down to about 1/2 worn, which was 13 events in my case, you need to be more concerned with the length of session and braking style. As you can see below, after a 30 minute session at an AMS trackday, I cooked the pads and rotors so badly I had to finally make the switch to Raybestos pads. I also had the OEM rotors turned to get rid of the grooves from metal v. metal contact during that session.

Burnt up stock pad after 13 events and a 30 minute session:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/Parts/IMG_7477.jpg

OEM pad backing plate (not Ti!):

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/Parts/IMG_7481.jpg

Grooved rotor from above burnt up pads:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/Parts/IMG_7473.jpg

The beginning of Blackbo's:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/Parts/IMG_7472.jpg

OEM Rotors w/Raybestos ST43 pads - I only ran this setup for one trackday, but it works. If you don't have the cash to upgrade your rotors you can get by just fine with only a pad/backing plate/fluid upgrade. At the time, Girodisc didn't have their new two piece rotors ready quite yet, but I needed pads badly. One problem is that Raybestos doesn't make rear pads that fit into the Evo X rear caliper yet. Girodisc came through with a prototype set of their pad 'adapters' to make the rear Evo IX ST43's fit into the larger Evo X caliper.

The OEM rotor/ST43 setup, along with fluid and Ti backing plates, is a great starting point for 95% of Evo X owners looking to track their cars. There shouldn't be any issues with overheating, even if you're doing 30 minute sessions in a stock 3,500lb+ car. And if there is...you may want to take a step back and look at your braking style. The Evo X is heavy out of the box, and you need to adjust for that. Be smooth. With this setup, I'd say you'll be just fine with a pretty basic fluid like RBF600. It's actually a really capable fluid that has a similar boiling point compared to Castrol SRF (the only other fluid I've ran).

Raybestos ST43's and Girodisc's pad adapters:

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm40/sexktten/mitsu-evo10-pad-adaptor-01.jpg

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm40/sexktten/mitsu-evo10-pad-adaptor-03.jpg

Brake lines - The next logical step for me was to upgrade the brake lines. The OEM lines are rubber to start, moving to hard lines closer to the caliper. It was cool to see that Mitsu used at least some hard lines to replace a full rubber hose, but still, braided stainless steel lines are a must if you plan to track the car...and even if you don't really. They offer better feel right off the bat, especially on track. Immediate response, with much more consistent pedal throughout a session. They don't flex or get too hot. I run AMS lines, at the time they were the only ones with an upgraded line out and I haven't needed to switch them out yet. Good stuff.

Brake Ducts - At the time (June 2008), I had plans to run the car on track for alot longer than I ended up running it. Thinking that I may end up running multiple 30 minute sessions back to back, I made my own brake duct kit. It took two days in the garage and like $100 in materials. There was many different ways I could do it, my first thought was to remove the foglight bulb and run the hoses from there and go for an inconspicuous route. That ended up not being the best route tho, way too many bends. I then looked for the straightest path. Removing the stock air guides next to the intercooler was my choice, doing that though required getting the JDM foglight deletes to keep airflow to the oil cooler...looks better anyways so win win. I spent the next two days trimming and cutting the hoses and other random parts of the car to make things fit.

Finally getting everything sorted out took awhile, but the way I had it setup was worth it. I had to make my own mounts to the caliper out of some scrap aluminum, but it worked out and was kinda fun. I tried to make the ducts from my Girodisc Evo IX kit work, but with the larger Evo X calipers it wasn't happening without a fab shop. I eventually took the kit off the car about a year later due to attrition. The orange tubing slowly getting beat up and with my homemade mounts not being ideal, it was hard to keep them mounted properly. It's all good though, at this point the car was almost 1,000lbs lighter than stock and I was no longer running for 30+ minutes around the track. Think of it as a cool project that was worth the experience. AMS now offers a much more complete brake duct kit that you can purchase here if you plan to get serious - http://www.amsperformance.com/cart/AMS-Mitsubishi-Lancer-Evolution-X-10-Brake-Cooling-Kit.html

Custom brake duct kit install pictures:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/IMG_0344_2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/IMG_0328_2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/IMG_0327.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/IMG_0321_2.jpg

Final product:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/NewFront.jpg

Girodisc Two Piece rotors - These were the final upgrade I made to the brakes on my Evo...probably my favorite too. The stock rotors aren't too heavy when you think of their size, but the Girodisc rotors are so light in comparison. They're pretty much 5lbs lighter per corner...a total of 20lbs+ of unsprung weight off the car is huge. I had just the front rotors on my Evo IX and was really impressed, but on the X I upgraded all four corners.

When Martin from Girodisc originally sent them over for their first track test, I was so pumped. Not only are two-piece rotors much lighter, they're also much more efficient with heat management...which helps on a number of levels. This is another reason why I was able to eventually remove my brake duct kit.

I ran the original set of rotors for the rest of the first season (June-Nov) without issue. All year they performed perfectly, coupled with my brake duct kit my brakes were on point in every session, no matter how long or hard I beat them. An added benefit of the two-piece rotors is how long the pads were now lasting. Raybestos ST43's always last long, but I was barely noticing any wear on them. I actually ran a single set of them all the way until the final event of '08, when I upgraded the fronts to a fresh set looking to get any extra time out of the car. I had upgraded to an FP Red at this point so it wasn't bad timing anyways haha.

With proper braking style, you should be able to make this setup last for a full season. I'm on my third set of Girodisc rotor rings, and the same prototype rotor hats. Seems like every June I order a fresh set of rotor rings, rotor hardware, and pads. That's insane. Every once in awhile, I'll throw a fresh set of pads in the front to get an extra edge, but the pads I take out are usually well within range. Granted my T/A sessions are only 5 laps, but don't forget about testing. I am almost always running the car, and when I'm out there testing the car it's usually for 20-40 minutes putting time on the setup to make sure it's all good. This season...seems like all that testing has been a waste the way things panned out during events, but that's another story....

OEM rotors weight Front and Rear:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/4.jpg

Girodisc two-piece rotors weight Front and Rear:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/5.jpg

Girodisc two piece rotors on the car:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/7.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/6.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/1.jpg

More coming up in the next post...

...continuing on:

Brake Pads - For the longest time, I had only run Raybestos ST43 pads, per Girodisc's recommendation. No complaints, and actually my favorite pad to ever run in an Evo. I tried many different pads in my Evo IX, but the Evo X has pretty much lived on these Raybestos. Awhile back, I did test a set of Project Mu Club Racers. These pads were pretty good...nice an quiet with good feel and nice heat management. Over time though, they started to fall off. They became soft after a few events, to the point that when Leh and I were going back and forth with the car we were actually complaining about the brakes. Soft initial bite, had to press real hard, etc. We switched to a new set of ST43's at the track and immediately never looked back. They are a much better pad overall. Much crisper, more consistent and longer lasting. I won't put another pad in the car.

Brake Squeal on my car - Another thing that was an issue this summer was noisy brakes on the car, seen in the vids posted below. I was busy testing the different pads kinda on and off for a few weeks, and in doing that the different pad materials while rubbing together made some nasty noise under braking! I called Martin at Girodisc and he knew right away how to fix it. He recommended 400 grit sandpaper and a minute a two per rotor. Just a quick sand to clear the rotor surface and all was well! Unfortunately, I was unable to get a vid of the car on track towards the end of the year with the 'development' issues haha. Soon though!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YITfILmk1mU&fmt=22

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uu7iE6FNMbI&fmt=22

Project MU's:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/PMU-1.jpg

Brake Fluid - I'm not too picky on fluid and my experience with a few different kinds just proves that. I currently run Castrol SRF, but throughout the years, I've ran out a few times and had to flush in some RBF600. I can't tell any difference between the two. That's also relative to how long I run the car on track...if I were doing endurance races, I'd probably have a stronger preference towards one or the other.

One thing of note - I did try RBF660 and absolutely hated it. For some reason it didn't work with my car at all. It boiled pretty huge in the first session I tried it, and again in the second...and that never happens. That day I switched back to SRF and haven't looked back.

OEM Caliper rebuild - After almost 3 years of track use, I finally sent my OEM calipers to Girodisc for a rebuild before my final event of 2010 as a precautionary measure. That's an insane amount of time for a caliper to last...let alone an OEM caliper! 11,000+ track miles on them, burnt out dust shields, red paint now straight black. It was time!

Even after all of that abuse, Martin at Girodisc said they were actually in pretty decent shape. The dust shields were completely gone, but the pistons and seals themselves actually looked pretty nice. Martin did a pretty thorough rebuild...took them apart and cleaned them, replaced all the seals and looked over the pistons, which were re-used. Have a look at a few pics during the process below.

Blackbo!:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/DSC051861.jpg

Inside the caliper:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/DSC051872.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/DSC051883.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/DSC051894.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/DSC051938.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/DSC051949.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/DSC0520015.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/DSC0520116.jpg

Piston outside the caliper:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/DSC0520318.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/OB%20X%20GSR/DSC0520823.jpg

Links to the parts I run -

AMS Brake lines - http://www.amsperformance.com/cart/AMS-Mitsubishi-Lancer-Evolution-Evo-10-Stainless-Steel-Brake-Line-Kit.html

Girodisc rotors (front) - http://www.amsperformance.com/cart/giro-disc-mitsubishi-lancer-evolution-x-2_piece-brake-rotors-front.html

Girodisc rotors (rear) - http://www.amsperformance.com/cart/Giro-Disc-Mitsubishi-Lancer-Evolution-Evo-10-2-Piece-Brake-Rotors.html

Girodisc Pad adaptors - http://www.amsperformance.com/cart/Giro-Disk-Brake-Pad-Adaptors.html

Castrol SRF - http://www.amsperformance.com/cart/Castrol-SRF-Racing-Brake-Fluid-%281-liter%29.html

*** Girodisc store is being urevamped at the moment, head to AMS for now. For Raybestos pads, you can always call Girodisc - (360) 450-5537 ***

That's pretty much it. I've had alot of experience with these Evo X brakes, and I really love them! At one point I almost switched to a StopTech kit, but the more I thought about it, it was just unnecessary. If anything, it added weight. The way my car is setup, the OEM calipers with Girodisc rotors, Raybestos ST43 pads, AMS lines, and Castrol SRF fluid is all I need.

Looking ahead, I don't see moving away from this setup. I'm very happy with the package we've developed, it's extremely efficient and works better than I could ever ask. Enjoy the thread and if there are any questions, feel free to ask!

Thanks :rock:

Evo as it sits now, going thru a restore this winter with much more to come:

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5209/5246489177_9fe8e6416f_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/gates311/5246489177/)
Clean Evo racer (http://www.flickr.com/photos/gates311/5246489177/) by Gates311 (http://www.flickr.com/people/gates311/), on Flickr

Really nice article. I wish I had read this some months ago. I have tried some setups at the track (always with RBF 600 or 660 and SS brake lines):

- OEM discs + OEM Pads: good, no fade. Lasted 2 trackdays (about 60 laps total) and some 400+ miles trips. I am still runing the rear ones.

- OEM discs + Hawk HPS: the worst combination. After just about 10 laps, the discs were completely glazed. Very low brake power. Had to put a lot of pressure in the pedal and lots of engine braking. Almost crashed another car due to this pad. I have installed them because people at the forums told they were better than stock;

- PowerSlot discs + HAWK DTC-70: amazing brake power, but after 7-8 laps, I was having some signals of fade. The discs got slightly warped. My wife use this pad in her car, with a StopTech ST-60 bbk and they shines. But for the Evo, it looks such pad are too aggressive. I was using the RBF 660 fluid. After your comment, I think I will turn to the RBF 600 (Castrol SRF isnt available over here).

- PowerSlot discs + TiSpeed Shims, Dust Shield removed + HAWK HPplus . Better than stock brake power, no fade. I wasnt doing long sessions (probably no more than 7 laps) at that trackday, but I havent even remembered the brake. Add the fact these are real cheap, I think I have a very reasonable setup;

Currently, for street I am running the BrakeMan pads at the front and OEM at the rear. The BrakeMan's rear pads were not Evo X specific and I was having a lot of noises while braking.

My GiroDisc 2 pieces (front and rear) with Raybestos ST43 (front and rear) and Magic Pads (front and rear) arrived at the end of 2010. I wish I have read your article before. It would have saved me a lot of time and money.

The rear ST-43 didnt come with adapters. Maybe they are Evo X specific currently.

Thank you,
Best regards,
Ziki

Cool to see someone else has tried a few different setups. It's funny you mention you heard a certain pad was good on the forums...it's always tough to discern who actually knows what they're talking about and who doesn't...alot of things appear 'great!' but they actually aren't... Be careful what you read on the forums haha...unless you know it's a trusted source ;)

The ST43's aren't Evo X specific as far as I know...but I think I heard Martin @ Girodisc say that they're coming. Maybe you got a new batch? If not, just order a set of pad adaptors and you'll be set, they're like $60. The Girodisc/ST43 combo you purchased is by far the best setup for the OEM calipers...you'll love it man!

The ST43s are available for the Evo front and rear now - no pad adapters required. I got them at the end of last year for my last track day of the season at VIR. Worked great on the stock rotors, but I'm planning to upgrade to the Girodisc 2 piece this year.

Great review. I've been through a couple of pad types, but have settled on the ST43s. Hawk HP+ were OK, but could not handle the heat at a really hot day at the track in July. By far the best upgrade I found so far were the SS lines - made the brakes so much firmer and gave much more feedback.

To round off this review, any advice on bedding in a new set of pads/rotors?

Oh tight, that's what I thought I heard...just wasn't sure.

The way I bed in a new set up is as follows, and usually I do it the morning of a trackday but works anytime.

- Five (5) 40mph --> 5mph medium stops...in a row

- Follow that up with anywhere from 5-10 (depending on ambient temp that day) 80mph --> 20mph hard stops in a row. This get things super hot and helps to ensure that everything is melding together and you have pure rotor contact with your new pads. Your brakes will definitely smell (good thing) and usually you'll start to feel slight fade (also good).

- Follow that by either a cool down around town while still using the brakes often, or like I usually do...follow up with a few laps around track, taking your time and making sure things are all good with the new setup.

Keep it simple and you should be good.

For anyone going to track, I would advise to make a "fresh" bed-in right on the event day (or day before), specially if you have to travel long distance to get there (as me). By using track/aggressive pads on street will undo the bed-in. I have seen this with other cars (specially with Hawk DTC-70), as well as the Evo X, with even the not-so-aggressive HPplus.

nice write up Ryan. Thanks for all the info.

awesome write up man. thanks a lot for the massive amount of useful info. keep up the good work hope next year goes a little smoother than this year for ya. :rock::thumbup::thumbup:

I ran the stock pads and fluid for my first couple track days. I should have changed the fluid being the car was a 2008 and I bought it new when the 2010's were showing up. Anyway, when trying to figure out the ABS threshold, I ended up boiling the fluid... not too surprising since it was in Georgia in August.

Shortly after I came across an amazing deal on a Brake Man brake kit off a show car, slightly used just to get too/from shows. I got it for about 20% its retail value, plus my OEM setup... and they even threw in a free set of race pads :) The kit replaced all four calipers, the front rotors (12.5lb piece!), and all lines. I haven't had any fade or heat issues so far while running RBF600 and Brakeman Xtreme6 fluid.

The stopping power and pedal feel on the kit is pretty freaking amazing... even on street pads at the track. The only gripe I have about it is that I'd like to adjust the bias to be a little more to the front. When I do any trail braking, the back end gets a little lose earlier than it used to. It causes anywhere from a few inches to a couple feet of oversteer before the ASC corrects it, depending on how hot i've come in. I've gotten the hang of it, and it's actually a lot of fun, but I'd still rather not have it.

Any idea how to adjust the brake bias? Is it just a matter of finding the right restrictor for the brake lines, or something more complicated than that?

awesome write up man. thanks a lot for the massive amount of useful info. keep up the good work hope next year goes a little smoother than this year for ya. :rock::thumbup::thumbup:
Haha thanks dude....it would be nice to run the car for a few laps!

I ran the stock pads and fluid for my first couple track days. I should have changed the fluid being the car was a 2008 and I bought it new when the 2010's were showing up. Anyway, when trying to figure out the ABS threshold, I ended up boiling the fluid... not too surprising since it was in Georgia in August.

Shortly after I came across an amazing deal on a Brake Man brake kit off a show car, slightly used just to get too/from shows. I got it for about 20% its retail value, plus my OEM setup... and they even threw in a free set of race pads :) The kit replaced all four calipers, the front rotors (12.5lb piece!), and all lines. I haven't had any fade or heat issues so far while running RBF600 and Brakeman Xtreme6 fluid.

The stopping power and pedal feel on the kit is pretty freaking amazing... even on street pads at the track. The only gripe I have about it is that I'd like to adjust the bias to be a little more to the front. When I do any trail braking, the back end gets a little lose earlier than it used to. It causes anywhere from a few inches to a couple feet of oversteer before the ASC corrects it, depending on how hot i've come in. I've gotten the hang of it, and it's actually a lot of fun, but I'd still rather not have it.

Any idea how to adjust the brake bias? Is it just a matter of finding the right restrictor for the brake lines, or something more complicated than that?
Sounds like a nice kit, good pick-up. Regarding bias....not sure. I could check with AMS. I don't see it being too hard tho, like you mentioned a different restrictor may be all you need.

finally, thought i'd need dentures and a new hip by the time this came out! excellent info, im only at about 1500 track miles so its good to know i can hold off a while on rebuilding em. when i finally get around to putting brake ducts on, im gonna grind out that mount under the crash beam where a bolt further secures bumper so it still looks ok and works. i cant upset the wife too much since the car is her name as well. and those were some great pics, good to know if i ever decide to get rear 2-pc rotors, ill shave 10 lbs. but im wondering if anyone has any experience with carbotech race pads on an evo x? getting xp12 front's, and xp10rears that've only been used for 1 track day. also im only running st43s in the front, would it be worth it to pick up some rears also?

also curious if anyone knows the weight of the stock MR front rotors?

finally, thought i'd need dentures and a new hip by the time this came out! excellent info, im only at about 1500 track miles so its good to know i can hold off a while on rebuilding em. when i finally get around to putting brake ducts on, im gonna grind out that mount under the crash beam where a bolt further secures bumper so it still looks ok and works. i cant upset the wife too much since the car is her name as well. and those were some great pics, good to know if i ever decide to get rear 2-pc rotors, ill shave 10 lbs. but im wondering if anyone has any experience with carbotech race pads on an evo x? getting xp12 front's, and xp10rears that've only been used for 1 track day. also im only running st43s in the front, would it be worth it to pick up some rears also?

also curious if anyone knows the weight of the stock MR front rotors?
I was actually really shocked how long the calipers lasted...pretty cool tho. It's cool that Girodisc sells rebuild kits so you can do it yourself too.

Also addressed the brake squeal issue from earlier this summer - it's in the second post!

:+1:

Nice writeup Ryan, pretty much agrees with what I found with the combo as well. I also won't use any other pad besides the Raybestos ST43 pads for the track and they really do hold up well even when the car is closer to a full weight daily driver.

As for bedding in the pads, that procedure definitely works well with the most important thing to do is get a proper cooldown on the setup before parking it the first time be it bedding on the street or track. The 2 piece Girodisc rotors made a huge difference in avoiding warped rotors after track days, seems the stock rotors like to heat glaze and cool unevenly once you start pushing the car harder.

My calipers aren't quite as black as those but my dust shields are also destroyed. I plan on installing the calipers off the Kids with Cancer car and rebuild them in the spring as spares. The Stoptech brakes on that car are insane but like you mentioned, not really needed with the factory Brembo calipers once the rotors, fluids, lines and pads are upgraded.

nice info... my pads are gone and I have to get new ones pretty soon.. I am only planning on tracking the car a few times this summer.. what should I really go for? also need fluids, should I go for the castro srf ryan mentioned??

Nice writeup Ryan, pretty much agrees with what I found with the combo as well. I also won't use any other pad besides the Raybestos ST43 pads for the track and they really do hold up well even when the car is closer to a full weight daily driver.

As for bedding in the pads, that procedure definitely works well with the most important thing to do is get a proper cooldown on the setup before parking it the first time be it bedding on the street or track. The 2 piece Girodisc rotors made a huge difference in avoiding warped rotors after track days, seems the stock rotors like to heat glaze and cool unevenly once you start pushing the car harder.

My calipers aren't quite as black as those but my dust shields are also destroyed. I plan on installing the calipers off the Kids with Cancer car and rebuild them in the spring as spares. The Stoptech brakes on that car are insane but like you mentioned, not really needed with the factory Brembo calipers once the rotors, fluids, lines and pads are upgraded.
Good to hear you're having the same experience with the setup!
nice info... my pads are gone and I have to get new ones pretty soon.. I am only planning on tracking the car a few times this summer.. what should I really go for? also need fluids, should I go for the castro srf ryan mentioned??
Ideally you'd like to have a dedicated set of track rotors and pads that you can swap out the morning of an event. It's actually a real quick swap once you've done it. There are some pads that can serve you well both on and off the track, but the issue with that is if you overcook them on a track day...you're kinda screwed on the drive home haha. You can get away with just a set of track pads, but then you are constantly marrying different pad materials on the same rotor. That can be just fine, but not ideal. Even a set of inexpensive 1-piece replacement rotors works as a track set, but I think you'd be better served saving for a little bit to get a nicer set of 2-piece rotors, if anything a set for the front would be a huge help. This is the setup I ran on my Evo IX, and I loved it. The swap took maybe 30mins in the morning and I was set with an awesome braking package.

Fluid-wise, Motul RBF-600 will be a good fit for you. It works great both on the street and around track. If you do a dedicated set of rotors/pads...think about the ST43's and a set of Girodiscs. I mean it's just brakes, not that big of a deal in the grand scheme of things...probably won't help you on the safety side of things ;)

Pic of the IX with ST43's and Girodiscs at Road America...good to have that dedicated set of pads/rotors!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/WW%20IX%20MR/DSC02717-1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v332/blacktrack/WW%20IX%20MR/Track2.jpg

thank for the info man! it helped me a lot! :) poor rotor on ur IX! :)

what about the pads? lets say I will track it a couple times but mainly it is for DD purpose..

Haha the rotor was fine...that's how you know it's working right!

Pads for DD and a few trackdays...hmmm. I'm not really the best with this, like I said I've never been a fan of doing it this way. Pretty much any upgraded street pad will be decent on the track though. Hopefully someone will chime in with some more info for you on this.

thanks! maybe I will get a street pad now and a track set this summer

I picked up a set of Ferrodo DS2500 for daily/autoX/once in a while track duty. It is too difficult to find a pad that works well every where and in all conditions. Best is to pick the middle road.

I picked up a set of Ferrodo DS2500 for daily/autoX/once in a while track duty. It is too difficult to find a pad that works well every where and in all conditions. Best is to pick the middle road.

was this one a good middle road for you?

was this one a good middle road for you?


Pretty much, DD about 80% of the time, 15% of autoX, and about 5% track duty over a course of a year.

thanks!

http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/tuning-and-upgrades/100479-review-of-performance-friction-pads-with-telemetry.html

Here is a excellent review of the PF vs Ferrodo 2500 review.

However, the PF's are more $$$ than the Ferrodo's in EVO X application.

Note: The Alfa used the same Brembo as the previous EVO/STi

there is no such thing as a pad that is great for both daily driving and track duty. its so ridiculously easy to change to a race pad the night before a track day. the evening of the track day or that same weekend ill change back to street pads.

there is no such thing as a pad that is great for both daily driving and track duty. its so ridiculously easy to change to a race pad the night before a track day. the evening of the track day or that same weekend ill change back to street pads.
Haha pretty much what I was getting at.

what about the pads? lets say I will track it a couple times but mainly it is for DD purpose..


In this case I would stick to the OEM.

the reason i give my wife for using track only parts is its cheaper in the long run. lapping destroys tires and brakes, i put as little wear on my street shit as possible. when my track stuff wears out, i'm not "oh no, i need xxx dollars to replace this so i can get to work on monday"

great writeup. im sure it will save me cash!

A word of advice for those using racing brake fluid in daily driven cars, make sure to flush when recommended! I've been using the same project mu g-four fluid since july and yesterday I had to drive home with basically no brakes, scary!

the reason i give my wife for using track only parts is its cheaper in the long run. lapping destroys tires and brakes, i put as little wear on my street shit as possible. when my track stuff wears out, i'm not "oh no, i need xxx dollars to replace this so i can get to work on monday"

amen bro. ain't that the truth.

I'm bumping this thread in hope to fix the issue I'm having with my brakes. I had SS line's and brake fluid installed about a month ago at a local performance shop in my area. Everything was fine brakes felt fine.

Today i had a track day at Thunderhill Race way. Had a blast NO BRAKE FADE all day but i noticed dried brake fluid coming from the bleeder screw and running down the caliper on all 4 corners only on the outside, inside bleeder screw tight and no dried up fluid.

Do you guys have any idea what is going on?

PICS:

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb101/MattCoon/P1020074.jpg
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb101/MattCoon/P1020072.jpg

TIA

i get that all the time too

i get that all the time too

So you saying that normal for the brembo's to leak brake fluid under hard braking? Or is it an issue with the little o-ring gasket thats on the bleeder screw?

Matt

That happened with my StopTech in another car. Tight those bolts while the brakes are hot. That solved my problem once for all.

im just saying it happens, i dont know why. but zikizira just gave a good tip

Ya I had that once. Just unwind the bleeder screw and then retighten the valve and that should solve it. Sometimes dirt can get stuck in the threads. Also make sure while bleeding the brakes to dry the area around the valve before puttin the cap back on.

I also got that dribble down the outside only. Sucks I didn't notice it in time and I think you can still see remnants.

bradze, any experience with what Ryan mentioned with regards to different pad materials stuck on the rotors?

I'm on the fence between track pads and DD pads or just a happy medium to cover both. I'm leaning towards swapping out for track days as both you and Ryan are a fan of this, but I'm just worried about material buildup.

Also, RBF600 has worked perfectly for me. I'm sure SRF is advantageous, but at my level, RBF600 is not only the more economical choice, but it's definitely adequate.

stick with Motul, lots of racers use it, easy to find, not too expensive, fuck SRF. ive never had any issues with pad material sticking to rotors, ive heard about ferodo ds2500 working well at cleaning off other pad material though, dont know if its true or not.

stick with Motul, lots of racers use it, easy to find, not too expensive, fuck SRF. ive never had any issues with pad material sticking to rotors, ive heard about ferodo ds2500 working well at cleaning off other pad material though, dont know if its true or not.

Using Motul RBF600 and love it!

Brake ducts and Titanium shields can allow you to run the more moderately priced brake fluids and over time are the more economical way to go.

When you overheat the brakes after driving them hard either through going really fast or dragging the brakes too much, you indeed can burn rotor material into the rotor causing hot spots. Generally a good cooldown session can avoid that situation as can quality 2 piece rotors with proper cooling ducts.

What I've found is that if you doing moderate braking for 600 feet versus heavy braking for 400 feet to slow the car down the same amount, usually the shorter (but heavier) application of the brakes ends up causing less heat and wear problems in the long run. Obviously you need to approach that from the conservative side since overshooting a braking zone isn't so good for obvious reasons either!

what he said, my ducts cost less than $200. at last track day i couldn't even get ti shields in (cuz of brand new pads), with that kind of cooling, i might be able to get away with $9 fluid at schucks.

Where are people getting these Ti shields from? PM would work please, thanks.

girodisc sells them, mine are tispeed, im sure there are others

why do i get a PM about brake advice every other day? this thread needs to be refreshed more frequently. also glad i looked at 1st page again, was thinking of getting project mu pads but will stick with st43s or carbotech xp12

Bradze you are just the best! Thanks for answering all these questions on here. I've been overseas alot recently, and while it's not an excuse, I'll go with that as to why I haev been MIA. Home now...any questions, just post here.

dont mention it, kinda strange so many are looking to me for advice on track oriented stuff. oh yeah, i was gonna post on here about how to install the brake ducts i have. less than $200 and very easy install but not many people need ducts

A word of advice for those using racing brake fluid in daily driven cars, make sure to flush when recommended! I've been using the same project mu g-four fluid since july and yesterday I had to drive home with basically no brakes, scary!

How do you like the G-Four fluid? I just bought some and am using it in place of the RBF600 mainly because of the higher boiling point for track.

not sure if i put it on this thread but i switched back to RBF600. the g-four expands a little too much and too expensive. everyone uses RBF600 so relatively easy to find. i also have ducts now so heat wont be much of an issue anymore

How much would a set of those brake ducts be? with black piping they'd be perfect!

the nozzles are $124, most high-temp hose is orange but i guess spray painting it constantly will work, also if vanity is even a consideration theyre not for you

not sure if i put it on this thread but i switched back to RBF600. the g-four expands a little too much and too expensive. everyone uses RBF600 so relatively easy to find. i also have ducts now so heat wont be much of an issue anymore

What do you mean by expands? Like compressability? When you step on the pedal, it is mushy? not direct?

I'll be running the G-four next track day, I guess I'll find out how it is.

i think he means that it tends to overflow the fluid reservoir when it heats up. Brake fluid expands with heat, which is why there's 'FULL' line on the reservoir leaves a bit of air.

not sure exact wording i should use but, once the fluid sees some heat it overflows in reservoir, all fluid i've used does this, but the G-four is much worse than any others. at track days i bring a turkey baster along to remove fluid from my reservoir back to the max line. with project mu i purposely would underfill the reservoir and still level in reservoir would go to cap. the RBF600 still rises but not so badly. this is just my experience, i tend to brake quite heavily, you may not have this problem. and i've only had a mushy pedal once at the end of a session and before i started using titanium shims.

before i started using titanium shims.

So you think the shims help? I've heard some people debate it.

not sure exact wording i should use but, once the fluid sees some heat it overflows in reservoir, all fluid i've used does this, but the G-four is much worse than any others. at track days i bring a turkey baster along to remove fluid from my reservoir back to the max line. with project mu i purposely would underfill the reservoir and still level in reservoir would go to cap. the RBF600 still rises but not so badly. this is just my experience, i tend to brake quite heavily, you may not have this problem. and i've only had a mushy pedal once at the end of a session and before i started using titanium shims.

Wow, that is interesting... I haven't seen this in any fluid I've run. I'll keep an eye out for it.

not sure exact wording i should use but, once the fluid sees some heat it overflows in reservoir, all fluid i've used does this, but the G-four is much worse than any others. at track days i bring a turkey baster along to remove fluid from my reservoir back to the max line. with project mu i purposely would underfill the reservoir and still level in reservoir would go to cap. the RBF600 still rises but not so badly. this is just my experience, i tend to brake quite heavily, you may not have this problem. and i've only had a mushy pedal once at the end of a session and before i started using titanium shims.

Funny, first time out on the track with the G-four mine was way too full once I got everything hot and overflowed a bit. It was messy, but cleaned it up and never had an issue after I removed some.

really? just about everyone ive talked to has to some extent. and yes the shims help, look at mine after 1 use http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x86/lilyluvr77/burnti.jpg?t=1305133721
other side is still blank titanium

also why i say if you have to pay for your titanium to discolor, you're a complete failure

So my front pads lasted about 5 track days and are now done... I like to brake late and hard. So I'm in the market for front and rear pads. I had DTC-60 on my STI and loved them.

I willing to try something new though. I was thinking of going with Raybestos ST43 front and rear with the girodisc front titanium pad shields for the fronts. Do you guys recommend anything else?

I going to be running on 180 tread wear street tires

Thanks

Matt

Raybestos ST43 front and rear with the girodisc front titanium pad shields for the fronts.

You can't do better in a track-only pad. Most of the discussions are about weekend warrior pads...there really is no debate about the ST43.

You can't do better in a track-only pad. Most of the discussions are about weekend warrior pads...there really is no debate about the ST43.
I've never used them, but is be interested to hear about how they compare to a carbotech xp14/12 setup. Bc those are some mean pads and I've loved them.

carbotech xp14/12

I run the 10/8 combo and love them but that's a weekend warrior setup.

I run the 10/8 combo and love them but that's a weekend warrior setup.

You're running too light of pads for your power and weight. We really need at least 12/10 on our cars. I know I switched and it was amazing the difference.

You're running too light of pads for your power and weight.

I don't drive that hard yet. I don't want pads that require trailering my car.

I don't drive that hard yet. I don't want pads that require trailering my car.

Another point of view: I switch to ST43s the weekend before a track event and drive with them to work/around town/up to the track event 2 hours away and don't feel the noise is anywhere near enough to have to trailer the car or wait to switch pads at the track.

don't feel the noise is anywhere near enough to have to trailer the car or wait to switch pads at the track.

There is a lengthy thread about the Carbotech on the other forum. The conclusion was that the 10/8 combo is difficult to fade on street tires. The 12/10 is more for r-comps. I've never heard of anyone running 14/12 on an Evo.

My experience so far is that the 10/8 feels like a DS2500 on the street and doesn't disappoint at my HPDEs. I run in the 'advanced' group more because my car is fast and not due to skill. I'm sure I'll work the brakes harder later on.

So my front pads lasted about 5 track days and are now done... I like to brake late and hard. So I'm in the market for front and rear pads. I had DTC-60 on my STI and loved them.

I willing to try something new though. I was thinking of going with Raybestos ST43 front and rear with the girodisc front titanium pad shields for the fronts. Do you guys recommend anything else?

I going to be running on 180 tread wear street tires

Thanks

Matt

Matt, if you think you are braking late and hard now, wait until you switch to ST43s. Of all my mods, they dropped my lap times the most. It's the only reason I can catch up the the GT3s and GTRs after a straightaway.

My first time with the pads ended up with smoking brakes and color turned calipers. I then added the titanium shims and cooling fins. After that, no more smoke and the calipers haven't gotten much darker yet.

Joe

i love the carbotech xp12/10 combo for my car, i also have raybestos st43s for the front only, use stock pad in rear. im parting out car so if i cant sell locally(wa evos see very very little use) ill put up a thread

I also run the XP 10/8 combo on mine. They ahev great initial bite for late braking.

Lucas

Just bought DS2500 for the front and rear. Hoping to maintain at least the stock level of performance for mainly a DD. Hope to get to a couple of track events this year. Both X and HPDE.

Matt, if you think you are braking late and hard now, wait until you switch to ST43s. Of all my mods, they dropped my lap times the most. It's the only reason I can catch up the the GT3s and GTRs after a straightaway.

My first time with the pads ended up with smoking brakes and color turned calipers. I then added the titanium shims and cooling fins. After that, no more smoke and the calipers haven't gotten much darker yet.

Joe

Well I'm going to go ahead and pick up a set of ST43s. Funny thing you mentioned that you drove around on them before your track day and they were not to bad on the streets. I did the same thing on my STi used the DTC60 for street use they were not bad but you had to be careful in the morning as stopping was non existent:duh:.

Should i expect slower wear from these pads, more than 5 track days?

Matt.

Matt,

IMO the ST43s wear VERY well. To put it in perspective, I only swap out/use ST43s in my front calipers. I used stock pads in the rear. After 5 track days I was surprised to see the rear stock pads worn all the way down to the backing while the front ST43s don't look worn down at all. In fact they still look new. I switched to DS2500s in the rear because I'm too lazy to change all 4 pads before a track event, but if the DS2500s wear away just as fast as the stock pads, I may have to buck up and change all 4 everytime. Beside stopping power, it's more cost effective to swap pads. See ya at the track.

Joe
(edit: btw, I haven't had an issue with stopping power when cold. I haven't felt it to be a safety issue at all)

i do exactly what he does. i only have 2 track days on my front st43s and very little wear, if i cant sell locally, ill post em for sale. my carbotech pads (xp12/10) are in as good of shape, same with them

I'm through a full season on one set of Brakeman pads and they're maybe half worn at most :D

Matt,

IMO the ST43s wear VERY well. To put it in perspective, I only swap out/use ST43s in my front calipers. I used stock pads in the rear. After 5 track days I was surprised to see the rear stock pads worn all the way down to the backing while the front ST43s don't look worn down at all. In fact they still look new. I switched to DS2500s in the rear because I'm too lazy to change all 4 pads before a track event, but if the DS2500s wear away just as fast as the stock pads, I may have to buck up and change all 4 everytime. Beside stopping power, it's more cost effective to swap pads. See ya at the track.

Joe

Thats great to hear! I'm now sold on this setup. Is there any reason why you guys stick with stock pads in the rear or something besides the ST43's?

Matt.

Thats great to hear! I'm now sold on this setup. Is there any reason why you guys stick with stock pads in the rear or something besides the ST43's?

Matt.

Supposedly the rears don't wear as quickly because they aren't doing the majority of the work like the fronts, but mind ending up wearing away after 5 track events anyway. Plus it takes extra time to swap the rears, although since I bleed all four brakes before an event I guess I might as well buck up and do all for pads...

Can't wait to try out my ST43's in a few weeks :).

The rears are very loud apparently, so I could see that being a reason why.

Supposedly the rears don't wear as quickly because they aren't doing the majority of the work like the fronts, but mind ending up wearing away after 5 track events anyway. Plus it takes extra time to swap the rears, although since I bleed all four brakes before an event I guess I might as well buck up and do all for pads...

I noticed that the rears wear crazy fast if you leave ASC on. With it on, the S-AWC system uses the rear brakes to stop oversteer. My rear rotor temps were usually 100*f hotter than the fronts after a session because of this.

This frustrated me for months because I was trying to use left-foot trailbraking and heavy acceleration into corners to enduce oversteer to rotate the rear end into a corner, but all it'd end up doing is burning up my rear brake pads! Once I started turning it off, my rear pads haven't worn a bit and the car does what I want. win-win!

I noticed that the rears wear crazy fast if you leave ASC on. With it on, the S-AWC system uses the rear brakes to stop oversteer. My rear rotor temps were usually 100*f hotter than the fronts after a session because of this.

This frustrated me for months because I was trying to use left-foot trailbraking and heavy acceleration into corners to enduce oversteer to rotate the rear end into a corner, but all it'd end up doing is burning up my rear brake pads! Once I started turning it off, my rear pads haven't worn a bit and the car does what I want. win-win!

Very good thing to know. I usually drive with ASC one push off, not off-off.

Hey guys,

Whats the proper brake bleeding procedure for the x? Who do you guys go through to get the ST43's? The only person im seeing having the pads are Girodisc themself's.

Thanks.

Matt:dancebanana:

Try MAP. Girodisc does not make the ST43...it's Raybestos.

There is a proper bleeding order but I didn't follow it and my brakes work. Go figure. Start at the back of the car and do the outside bleeders...the inside ones don't take long.

use this for bleeding http://www.joe250.com/cars/evo8/brakebleeding/evo8brakebleeding.html

i have front st43s for sale only used twice

A motive power bleeder will save you tons of time and grief. I bleed before every event. Got my ST43s from girodisc. Get some motul 600 fluid too.

I had a fantastic run this weekend on xp12/10 combo. To the point I boiled ate super blue :-). Castrol SRF is on its way to my house lol.

A motive power bleeder will save you tons of time and grief. I bleed before every event. Got my ST43s from girodisc. Get some motul 600 fluid too.

Yes Sir ill get right on and buy that fluid! LOL:neener:

Talked to Yohan today at Girodisc awesome guy to work with and he got me everything i needed.

-F/R ST43's Pads
-Front Ti shims
-3 bottles of RBF600

This sould be a great track setup. Can't wait to test them out at Buttonwillow the 11th&12th. Thanks for all your advice guy's it really helped me out.

Matt.

Just adding info to this thread:

I have used a set of EBC Yellow in a trackday. After about 20 laps, the brakes started to work less. I needed to brake hard. My discs become kind of wasted. I do not recommend these pads for trackday.

i wouldn't waste the money on SRF, motul rbf600 works well, is cheap and so many use it.

For under $100/year extra, I'll take the 1% (really much more) advantage the srf gives. Its like no money compared to everything else. Like buying BC came vs gsc or kelford to save fifty bucks.

BRAKE CALIPER PLACEMENT

Why are they situated where they are situated? I see random configurations of brake caliper placement on the rotors and I often wonder why.

I noticed most Porsches place the calipers inside the square, our Evos are performance-oriented yet they're placed exactly opposite. Why have the caliper hang off the front in the front and behind in the rear? I understand this placement is not a night-and-day difference, but every little bit helps, no?

Anybody else ever wonder this?

I know why fuel tank doors are on the side they end up, but never figured out why brake calipers are placed inside or outside (besides the obvious ease of access depending on factory suspension configuration).

Higher performance cars will [in many cases] place the calipers in a location [mostly in front] where the most cool air from whichever cooling configuration they use can get to them.


edit:

Road and Track had the following to say as well:

Because caliper placement relative to the rotor is immaterial to clamping force; the considerations in caliper placement are for airflow and packaging. The front-axle packaging is typically more constrained by the steering gear, and thus calipers tend to be at the 6 and 9 o'clock positions there. Rear calipers typically face fewer placement obstacles, and then it is the parking brake cable and other packaging issues that prevail.

Read more: http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/tilted-motors/128321-there-purpose-behind-brake-caliper-placement.html#ixzz1NQIIMAKz

stuff
Thank you sir. I didn't even take cooling into account. The rest is just like I thought, packaging...

Word.

Very nice info.

Which endless pads are good for street and track use? is it the ss-h or the ss-s??

Got all excited about saving 20lbs of mass on those rotors... then I saw the price...

u typically want weight placed near the center of a car. a rally-type car is a little different than pure sports cars. f1 cars have the calipers on the bottom of the rotor, but for street cars every thing is about cost effectiveness