CAN output datalogging

6636 Views 56 Replies 9 Participants Last post by momostallion, Aug 31, 2015

orthojoe

Discussion Starter · Jan 28, 2012

So I'm looking into getting a new laptimer/datalogger. I'm researching a unit made by AIM called the Solo DL.

Apparently the Solo DL can log through the obd2 port, or you can splice into the CAN line. Apparently if you splice into the CAN line directly, you will get a faster output rate, and more channels to log than through the obd2 port alone.

Is this true? I thought all you tuners/loggers go through the obd2 port and still have access to the CAN output lines?

Here is a link to the .pdf that explains how to tap into the CAN lines in our car, and what kind of channels are available with logging. (steering angle output would make for some cool video).
http://www.aim-sportline.com/download/ecu/stock/mitsubishi/Mitsubishi_Lancer_EvoX_101_eng.pdf
They describe two methods to tap into the CAN lines. The first is directly off the ECU, the other is off the 'differential control unit'? Any idea where the differential control unit is? Is it under the dash?

Does all of this make sense to anyone?

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Tephra

· #2 · Jan 29, 2012

No the ECU still rate limits the requests.

Connecting directly to the CAN-BUS will bypass the ETACS middle-man, but wont really give you any extra increase in speed...

You can access most if not all of the other ECU's "stuff" via the OBD2 port anyways...

jordantii

· #3 · Jan 29, 2012

I worked for AiM for the past 2 years. I would only log via CAN. I am logging with an EVO 4 and a MyChron 3 display. I tapped into the diff controller. It's just under the left side of the dash towards the firewal and is easily accessible. I am going to see if CAN is available at the OBD port. I know it is but AiM may not be able to read it from there.

The Solo DL is a great product.

Here are the instructions.

http://aim-sportline.com/download/ecu/stock/mitsubishi/Mitsubishi_Lancer_EvoX_101_eng.pdf

Tephra

· #4 · Jan 29, 2012

CAN is available via the OBD2 port.

Thats how EvoScan/my logger and EcuFlash all communicate to the ECU(s)

jordantii

· #5 · Jan 29, 2012

Yes OBD is a request based stream as oppossed to CAN is open in both directions. Also, with OBD you will only get a generic set of channels: RPM, speed, temp etc. With CAN you will see more info, 4 wheel speeds, MAF, temp, steering angle etc. Also, they will be able to sample at higer rates as well.

Tephra, unfortunately the CAN template AiM has is limited. For example, the boost does not read right. This is why I have an external MAP sensor.

If you can read CAN it is always best.

jordantii

· #6 · Jan 29, 2012

Tephra said:
CAN is available via the OBD2 port.

Thats how EvoScan/my logger and EcuFlash all communicate to the ECU(s)

I know, pin 6 and 14 but for some reason AiM can not read it from there. It is not the same as it is from the ECU or the diff controller. I am going to test it next week just to verify. We had this problem with some BMW's as well. M3's were fine, 2007 E90's were not. Go figure.

Tephra

· #7 · Jan 29, 2012

well it sounds like an issue with the AiM unit.

because for me it works 100% via the OBD2 port... Using CAN...

jordantii

· #8 · Jan 29, 2012

It's not any of the units. Like I said, CAN at OBD is not the same as the ECU and the diff controller. It is not "free" at the OBD connector.

AiM has an extensive background in CAN and ECU's. But in this case and a few other stock ECU's there can be some proprietary data and protocols that we are not privy to. Many manufacturers provide us with the CAN template, BMW and Mitsu do not provide this data. Yet Ferrarri, Porsche, Lambo and many others do.

Do you have the CAN template for the car?

Tephra

· #9 · Jan 29, 2012

not an official one...

its not the same, no, but you can access the same data with it.

how does the configuration of the Solo DL work?

From memory you worked for AiM yeh?

If you can send me one of these units I will try and get it working via the OBD port (as thats far more convenient than tapping directly into one of the bus's)

jordantii

· #10 · Jan 29, 2012

Tephra said:
not an official one...

its not the same, no, but you can access the same data with it.

how does the configuration of the Solo DL work?

From memory you worked for AiM yeh?

If you can send me one of these units I will try and get it working via the OBD port (as thats far more convenient than tapping directly into one of the bus's)

Yeah, I used to work for them. Just stopped in October.

I am sure I can get AiM Italy to send you some stuff. But my first thought is for you to get in contact with the engineer that writes all of our ECU templates. It may be faster that way. But either way if you help them out I will make sure you get some fun stuff to play with:rock:

You can download Race Studio 2 to look at the software and you should be able to see how we confugure a logger. Very simple.

Tephra

· #11 · Jan 29, 2012

ahh ok...

well if you give them my contact details (myforumname atgmaildotcom)

I will see what I can do..

jordantii

· #12 · Jan 29, 2012

Sounds good.

orthojoe

Discussion Starter · #13 · Jan 29, 2012

Wow, I walk away from the computer to do some errands, I come back and I get a freaking awesome discussion from two guys that know their stuff. I love this forum!

Yes, from what little I know, I think both of you guys are right. CAN is accessible through the obd2 port, but for some reason not all of the channels are available through there, at least where AIM is concerned.

This is not unique to the Evo. I have been searching through the rennlist forums regarding the Solo DL as well, and they have come to the same conclusion. On Porsches, you can only access limited stuff through the obd2 port. They recommend a direct CAN connection as well.
http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforu...2-aim-solo-gps-lap-timer-available-399-a.html

It would be obviously easier to access through the obd2 port. Particularly for me since I plan to swap the Solo unit between the 2 cars I track. I'm looking forward to reading what else you guys have to say.

Jordantii, now that you don't work at AIM anymore. What are you thoughts on the RLC track commander unit?

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Tephra

· #14 · Jan 29, 2012

well anything useful to us is available via the OBD2 port... over CANBUS...

orthojoe

Discussion Starter · #15 · Jan 29, 2012

jordantii said:
With CAN you will see more info, 4 wheel speeds, MAF, temp, steering angle etc. Also, they will be able to sample at higer rates as well.

Tephra, unfortunately the CAN template AiM has is limited. For example, the boost does not read right. This is why I have an external MAP sensor.

If you can read CAN it is always best.

Jordantii, you mention that the boost that AIM reads off of CAN is not correct. Do any of the other channels read incorrectly? One of the channels is labelled 'pedal position sensor'. Which pedal is it logging? throttle or brake?

Tephra

· #16 · Jan 29, 2012

can you change the configuration of the AiM box directly?

orthojoe

Discussion Starter · #17 · Jan 29, 2012

Tephra, I don't own a AiM Solo DL yet, but the more I read into it, the more likely it is I'm going to get one, especially if you're going to have a hand in making it even better!

I wish I could tell you more about being able to change the configuration directly, so I'll have to defer to jordantii

jordantii

· #18 · Jan 29, 2012 (Edited)

I would not bother with RLC. What you are getting with AiM is not only the hardware but the Analysis software as well.

I have never seen an RLC unit in a professional race car and there is a reason for that.

The only reason boost reads incorectly is because they do not have the can template for it or the math is wrong. I stopped messing with it and went with an external MAP sensor.

Pedal Possition should be the gas pedal. The brake is just a switch so on and off. There is no pressure sensor in the car. If you are serious and logging and doing data analysis you woukld want to move up to an EVO 4 and separate display. But there is a jump in price.

Not sure what you mean by changing the configuration of the Solo DL. In order to configure it to a specific car/ecu you have to connect it to Race Studio 2 and tell it what car/ecu it will be connected to.

The OBD/CAN thing is as I said a manufacturer issue. There is sometimes a sort of "key" that is at the CANBUS via pins 6 and 14 at the OBD connector.

And Ortho you can be hardwired to one car or both or OBD in one and hardwire in the other just get the extra cable.

Like I said I will be testing the OBD port this week once I get a cable from AiM US.

Either way you cant go wrong with the Solo DL as a beginning data logger.

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zikizira

· #19 · Jan 29, 2012

EvoScan Nav is quite good and, since it uses mode23, it will log all kind of data from Evo X. The downsize: it is not easy for the first setup. It doesnt provides a LapTimer.

If you have an Iphone, Harry Lap Timer would be a very good option, but you might need an external GPS, since the internal iphone GPS is not precise. I have been using Iphone + tom tom car kit + wiki wifi + Harry Lap Timer. The videos are awesome and you can produce them real quick without a computer.

discogodfather

· #20 · Jan 29, 2012

jordantii said:
There is no pressure sensor in the car.

Not to nitpick but there are a few, maybe nothing in the CAN.

There is in the Hydraulic Unit (ACD / AYC Pump) that monitors accum pressure and pump pressure anomalies, but not line pressure. There is also pressure sensors in the ASC (ABS) unit as well I believe.

The SST has a pressure/temp combo sensor right? That could be going through the CAN to the ECU?

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