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Discussion Starter #1
Hi Everyone, GO GO First Post!

I own a sexy black 2011 Evo X MR and my only mods are an ETS UICP and Cobb's v403 Stage 1 91 octane map. The vehicle has 20,000 km's on her and I've only launched her twice (both without slowdown message).

Lately I've been noticing that when I start to moderately accelerate while already in motion the RPM's will jump up about 100 rpm and will either settle back down or continue on with the acceleration depending on the throttle angle. This phenomenon occurs in Normal, less in Sport, and almost unnoticeable in S-Sport. Also, I've noticed getting from 1 - 7 counts of knock in normal, 1-3 counts of knock in Sport, and 1 count of knock in S-Sport right when I initially try to accelerate.

If I accelerate hard from a stop in Sport and S-Sport, she appears to change gears flawlessly with no knock to speak of. I haven't tried this in normal.

This RPM jump occurs with the Cobb AP installed & flashed and without (Factory Map).
I live in Alberta Canada and have been noticing this behavior since it started to get quite cold (below freezing to -25C). This issue could have been happening in the summer although I didn't notice anything at the time.

I've inquired with Cobb about this issue and their initial diagnosis is I'm experiencing SST slippage from Clutch Wear.

The vehicle feels quite fluidic in it's acceleration through the RPM range although the transmission occasionaly decides to engage/disengage/buck while crawling in traffic. Also, my gear change from 3 to 4 is quite abrupt and quick if I'm accelerating at half throttle in normal mode. I've never had any DTC's, lost gears, or anything else negative.

TL;DR


  • 2011 MR - ETS UICP,
  • Car's RPM jump and/or bounce up 100 RPM while initially accelerating,
  • Occurs tuned and stock,
  • Knock is often detected with initial acceleration, Car seems to be doing well regardless,
  • Cobb believes it's clutch slip from clutch wear,
  • First Post!
I've tried searching Google which references both this site and the other one with little success.
Has anyone else experienced anything like the issue above? If so, what was your fix/outcome/nightmare?

Thanks in advance!
 

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Hrm...got a log or two of this? Is the knock in low load regions? Are you letting the car fully warm up since you are in a cold region? Is the weird slipping occurring when its cold? Need more info :p

Thanks!
verkion
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Hrm...got a log or two of this? Is the knock in low load regions? Are you letting the car fully warm up since you are in a cold region? Is the weird slipping occurring when its cold? Need more info :p

Thanks!
verkion
Hi verkion,

I've attached a couple logs demonstrating the knocksum component of my issues.

The knock occurs between a load of ~130 - 180.

I usually let my car idle for a minute or two and then baby it for the next few minutes past the point of the engine being warm.

I have noticed this knock and slipping since it's been cold. How long can a transmission take to warm up in -10C weather/snow/slushy roads?
 

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Wish I could help more with specifics, but tuning is not something I'm comfortable with.

Is the knock occurring with the stock map?
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
Wish I could help more with specifics, but tuning is not something I'm comfortable with.

Is the knock occurring with the stock map?
Attached are logs using Cobb's v402 Stage 0 map. I noticed a lot of knock using this map. There are sections where I saw knocksums up into the 10's and usually associated with accelerating.

I don't have any other tuning/logging methods aside from the AP so I can't enable mode 23 to log knocksum on my vehicle's own stock map.

Thanks for your interest.
 

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The 402's are known for knock. most change to the 403's to sort this out.

Although with an MR the OTS Cobb maps are junk and so is the AP. You need a proper tuner.
 

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The knock may well just be the tune itself - some of the 91 maps from cobb i have seen run ridiculous timing maps.
the SST can take a good 10-15mins to warm up in 0*C so i'm guessing in your silly Canuck weather you could need 20mins or so - but i would expect after 10mins of running even in super cold ambients there would be enough heat in the system for the fluid to work "normally".
Maybe there is something funky in the map causing clutches to slip...


I'd be spending a bit of coin to get it tuned properly and then if it is still not right, warranty 100%.
If you load up the OEM tune does it still slip? if so, don't mess around - it's a 2011 just take it back to its maker and bitch about it until it's fixed. you don't have "clutch wear" on a lightly tuned 2011 unless something is pear shaped in the tune or the hardware.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Thanks for the reply Beeble.

My RPM bouncing occurs most frequently in temperatures below -10C and usually in a low RPM and moderate load. I can usually reproduce the 'blip of ~100 rpm' in normal-auto around 80 km/h in 6th (this is the gear that normal chooses) with just a moderate 'blip' to the throttle. There is the appropriate feeling of light momentary acceleration associated with the increase in throttle like something is grabbing.

There is no noticeable noise from the engine nor transmission that I can hear, nor is there any feeling of any slippage with the blip. If I continue to hold down the throttle there is little to no noticeable rpm bouncing per se, more of a small jump and hold. Acceleration feels smooth.

Using the OEM tune that came with the car or Cobb's Stage 1 403 91 octane tune: If I floor it (put it under high load) in any gear at any RPM especially in Sport or S-Sport there never appears to be any slipping. She grabs hard and doesn't let go through the whole RPM band. There again, it's hard to pay attention to anything other than the thrill of my Evo @ WOT. She sure is amazing when driven hard!

Could the lack of contraction in my ETS UICP cause my issue? What I mean is the throttle response with my ETS UICP seems quicker than the soft OEM UICP due to lack of contraction of the UICP. Could the stock tune be relying on the momentary loading of the OEM UICP and gets confused with the more instantaneous response from the hard UICP?

Anyways, would an e-tuner be able to help me with my issue (be it mechanical or software based)?

Is there anything I could look for mechanically?

  • I've retightened my UICP,
  • I've checked and zip-tied my FPR hose (both ends).
  • Nothing appears out of place or loose in the engine bay.
  • 20,000 kms (12500 miles).
  • I topped off coolant as it was just below the min mark 6 months ago, now its dropped a bit and is halfway between max and min.
Again, thanks for all of the help.
 

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Like Leezon pointed out, Cobb OTS maps suck for the SST. I personally ran into a whole bunch of problems on my old MR and ended up junking the whole AP.

It would be worth it to invest in a Tatrix cable and then download EvoScan on a laptop to check what your stock tune is doing.

Wish I could help you out the the RPM jump issue. Have you ever replaced the SST fluid? If you have never touched it, it by be a good idea to have the fluid changed as well as the filter. (I'm crazy and recently changed the fluid on my SST at 23,000 miles lol)
 

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Like Leezon pointed out, Cobb OTS maps suck for the SST. I personally ran into a whole bunch of problems on my old MR and ended up junking the whole AP.
Yup, me too.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Thanks for the advice Mendo & Leezon.

I think it's time to go the open source route. Just to make sure, the products I will need to log my vehicle are a Tactrix Openport 2.0 and EvoScan. Does it matter which version of EvoScan? Currently, their website is featuring version 2.9.0023.

I haven't ever changed my SST fluid. I will definitely look into that as well. I have a friend who purchased a used MR with around 13000 miles on it. He decided to change his SST fluid at around the same mileage as you Mendo and he was amazed at how fluidic his shifting became.

Maybe I can see if Santa will bring me a wideband for Christmas as well! As an aside, Is there any way to hook up a wideband sensor and attach it directly to the Tactrix Openport 2.0 so I don't need to install any gauges in my vehicle? I've read the nicely written article on using the Rear O2 sensor input as your wideband signal. Is the Rear 02 sensor used by the ECU for anything important? Maybe this is a conversation for another thread.

Again, thanks everyone for your help!
 

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Just to make sure, the products I will need to log my vehicle are a Tactrix Openport 2.0 and EvoScan. Does it matter which version of EvoScan? Currently, their website is featuring version 2.9.0023.
2.9.0023 is the one you want, yes.

Make sure you check out RAX Fast Logging. This is a reasonably straightforward ECU patch that is applied via EcuFlash. It works with EvoScan 2.9.0023+ "RAX Fast Logging" mode to deliver improved data logging.

Rich
 

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2.9.0023 is the one you want, yes.

Make sure you check out RAX Fast Logging. This is a reasonably straightforward ECU patch that is applied via EcuFlash. It works with EvoScan 2.9.0023+ "RAX Fast Logging" mode to deliver improved data logging.

Rich
^^^ Do this.

I have the regular AEM AFR gauge and I know there is a way to hook it up to your lap top and set EvoScan to read from it, but I haven't looked into the connector yet.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I have my Tactrix Openport 2.0 on it's way and EvoScan 2.9.0023 is downloaded!

I will definitely look into logging with that RAX patch, thanks Richardh.

Next step is to select a wideband. I am leaning towards the AEM ones as they specifically say that it never needs to be re-calibrated and it appears that there are many forum members who use AEM AFR gauges and boost gauges.

Time for a little research...
 

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re: wideband - go with an innovate MTX-L. You can easily get a serial - USB connecter and log asap with it. the AEM gauges you need to monkey-fuck around and make your own cable. You need to calibrate the MTX-L which is a pain in the ass but the AEM one is even more of a pain.

Also - good on you for going open source. Take you Cobb AP and put it in the toilet. Use it as toilet bowl decoration perhaps, it's all it's good for.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
re: wideband - go with an innovate MTX-L. You can easily get a serial - USB connecter and log asap with it. the AEM gauges you need to monkey-fuck around and make your own cable. You need to calibrate the MTX-L which is a pain in the ass but the AEM one is even more of a pain.

Also - good on you for going open source. Take you Cobb AP and put it in the toilet. Use it as toilet bowl decoration perhaps, it's all it's good for.
I will take a look at Innovative's MTX-L. That gauge definitely looks sharp!

I looked at their LC-2 (the successor to the LC-1). I really liked the fact I could get it installed right away without having to worry about mounting a gauge. However, I am not too thrilled about having to re-calibrate the sensor every 6 months for optimal reading.

My fondness for AEM stems from the fact that it never needs to be re-calibrated.
 
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